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Re:GO AWAY MR STYLE - 2008/03/30 11:24Well said jamesb. So let's lay down a challenge to these moaners...
Give us ONE positive suggestion (other than a rude or facetious one) about the future of the Phoenix Estate, and tell us what is so wrong with the latest Master Plan as published on this site (rather than just try to avoid the question).
So come on, let's hear it!
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sashka
Re:GO AWAY MR STYLE - 2008/03/30 12:00ADAM,
If you read many of the entries on this website, you will see that almost no-one wants to see this crappy rundown trading estate to remain like it is. In fact many people were initially very happy to listen to Mr Style's promises. Unfortunately we then started experiencing the actual way in which Mr Style works, what he says, how inconsistant it is and how he breached Planning regulations in Southwark in the most audacious way. I am no lawyer but I would think that what he has done is illegal. Misleading Planning Committee members is without doubt completely unethical.
I have already asked you twice, but with no success, if you know if there is an explaination for this that would give us all reason to trust Mr Style again? This is a planning matter which revolves around the reliability, and accuracy of how a developer operates, not a popularity contest.
Mr Style could be a charming, but vile, lying , incompetaent money obsessed, pretentious wannabe, who falls out with everyone he comes across, for all I know. BUT if he delivered wonderful architecture as promised and approved, I really don't care.
I don't know how young you are, and you pressume that I am not, but if you really are committed to the improvements we would all like to see, I would suggest you contact Mr Style, if you haven't already done so, and ask him to explain to us all, what on earth he thought he was doing in Southwark, that has caused complete and utter misery to the hundreds of people affected, as well as the finances of the Council who have had to deal with him.
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jamesb
Re:GO AWAY MR STYLE - 2008/03/30 12:52Sashka, once again you continue to relate all your criticism to a project which has nothing to do with Lewes. There may well be very good explanations as to why that project has run into difficulties. You maintain that you want to see the Phoenix area redeveloped. That is easier said than done. What good ideas do you have as to how this should be done? Angel Property have acquired the land and have put forward a very well thought through proposal which they have consulted on widely. Have you got any better ideas, you say you would rather it was sold to a "credible developer" to be developed, no doubt it will be at some point. Charles Style has gone on record saying that he will be bringing in other partners to develop the site as it is too large an enterprise for his company to handle alone, it seems you would rather he had nothing to do with it at all, but his company owns the site and can choose whether to stay in Lewes or not. If it is sold to a big corporate entity, credible yes, but will they actually care as much about how the scheme is built and designed or will it all become less personal and more like any other development. There are a lot of very " credible developers" building a lot of hideous rubbish all over this country, is that what we want for Lewes? Even big credible developers have projects which run into difficulties. The forum here is open and all you do continually is to harp on about the Jam Factory, what is important is what goes into the planning of this area and whether it fulfills a local need, the personalities are less important. Lewes Council has said they do not chose who the developer will be and nor can you, anyone is free to buy land in Lewes or elsewhere. They have to look at the proposal on its merits.
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sashka
Re:GO AWAY MR STYLE - 2008/03/30 13:30James B
Yes developers do often have lots of problems, especially incompetent unprofessional companies who are completely out of their depth, but have the benefit of someone elses money to spend.
I will ask you the same question that I asked Adam. It is very relevent to us here in Lewes. Have you asked Mr Style why he completely ignored the planning approval he had been given and built a 5 story building without permission, and tried to mislead Councillors in Southwark? We would all like to know what the answers are.
Perhaps you are not aware of the other issues concerning the Southwark Planning Officers that Mr Style was dealing with, and who are no longer employed by Southwark? The Council is aware of these issues. Perhaps you are not aware that Lewes District Council went to meet with Southwark to discuss the matter. It seems Lewes District Council think that the Jam factory catastrophe has a lot to do with proposals in Lewes and are deeply concerned.
Are you saying perhaps that you support a developer misleading planners, Councillors and Lewes resident. You are entitled to hold such an unconventional view. Perhaps you would be happy to pay the extra in Council Tax it would cost to sort the mess out afterwards, whilst the developments remains unfinished years later? Like most people in Lewes I am not happy about this at all, and I doubt the planners are either. If you read other parts of this site you will see that Mr Style is already wasting hours of our alrteady stretched Officers time with his approach to the planning process and I have every sympathy for them.
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doodles
Re:GO AWAY MR STYLE - 2008/03/31 09:59Thankyou so much to both adam and jamesb for your positive responses we need more people who think positively. Yes the jam factory went wrong but can we not give Charles a second chance? He moved to lewes to join the community and provide for the community and a huge amount people have given him nothing but negativity, what does that say about our town? that we a selfish, rude and uninviting town. Everyone makes mistakes and everyone learns from them , he wouldnt go into another project aiming to make more mistakes.
The big issue here that people dont seem to understand is that if Charles continues to be slated, he will give up and sell the land to some unoriginal building company who will give lewes a fifth housing estate. DO WE WANT HALF A HOSUING ESTATE AND A CINEMA , CAFES SHOPS OR PURELY AN UGLY HOUSING ESTATE?
I know what i want, and in my eyes its for the good of the town, i will be at university when the development is in construction but my family will be here and my littel brothers are grwoing up and i want them to have more than i had inn this town, i want to come back to the town i grew up in and consider it a place to start a family but right now lewes does not provide enough for its youth and its not fair.
I think the bickering should stop and people should really think about the oppertunity that lewes has been given before its too late and we end up with just another housing estate.
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jstockdale
Re:GO AWAY MR STYLE - 2008/03/31 11:00jamesb, adam and doodles are clearly not going to be satisfied with the 'Angel can't be trusted' argument based on their track record in Southwark. So what about their track record in Lewes?
The Phoenix Industrial Estate is a mess because (a) it flooded in 2000 and (b) it is blighted by Angel Property's plans to redevelop it. Several major businesses have moved out. No one is doing any long term development or maintenance. Two of the units have burnt down and Angel as landowner have done nothing to clear the sites. In fact, Charles Style used a photo of his run down estate as the introduction to a presentation to the Friends of Lewes last week, seeking support for his scheme. Well, you're the owner, Charles. Why should we be blackmailed by your neglect of your property into accepting an inappropriate development?
Why is it inappropriate? There are a lot of viable businesses on the Phoenix Industrial Estate providing jobs and services to the community. Every town needs a place where you can get your car fixed - and it isn't always the best looking district.
This land is subject to serious flooding. River flood defences provide some protection - but they are not a complete solution and they create other problems - pushing the water away to flood somewhere else and trapping ground water and run off from the hills behind the barrier. Flood defences will be overtopped in the lifetime of the housing proposed for the site. We believe they should only be used to protect existing settlements and not new ones. The 2000 flood affected just one house on the Phoenix. Angel are proposing to put another 600 at risk.
So what should be done with this run down estate? East Sussex is hard pressed for land for housing AND for employment. So, this site which is zoned for light industrial use should continue to be used for that. The existing units should be replaced as and when their tenants and the landowner agree with flood resilient buildings which can cope with occasional flooding. Some of the existing buildings can be reclad to improve their look and extend their lives. Charles Style has said that Sussex Innovation Centre will move to the new development in the first phase. He should pursue this, attracting other IT and media businesses to Lewes as well. A riverside walk could link the new IT/Media centre to the town centre.
The big advantages of this scheme is that it could all be done gradually without huge expense and without clearing the site and disrupting businesses. Commercial and industrial buildings generally have a shorter lifespan than housing, so if the gloomier predictions of sea level rise and climate change are borne out, there's less at risk. If they are not, the next generation will be able to reconsider what to do with the site.
So is that positive enough?
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